RIP Flash

[billbenson]

Facebook and Firefox are blocking Flash.

Firefox blocks Flash, and Facebook calls for its death - Jul. 14, 2015 (http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/14/technology/flash-firefox-facebook/index.html)

[vangogh]

I guess news travels slow in Firefox and Facebook land.

I don't have Flash installed on my any device and I haven't missed it at all. I barely even notice it's not there. Occasionally a video insists on using Flash, but I can't think of any that were so important to me. I just move on to the next thing. I know I don't miss the daily popup telling me to install the latest version of Flash for the newest security threat.

Flash was a good program years ago when it was the only way to reliably play video on the web. That changed years ago and it simply isn't necessary any more and every day less and less people will be able to view them.

[Harold Mansfield]

The death of flash has been announced many times in the past. I think it'll be around for a little while longer till everyone catches up to running the latest version of things.
I still know people running Windows XP and IE 8.

[turboguy]

I still know people running Windows XP and IE 8.

I am not sure how accurate my tracking program is but on one of my main sites it is showing 32% of my traffic running Windows XP. I took a quick look at another of my sites and it is showing 16% running XP.

[Harold Mansfield]

I am not sure how accurate my tracking program is but on one of my main sites it is showing 32% of my traffic running Windows XP. I took a quick look at another of my sites and it is showing 16% running XP.

Wow. I didn't know it was that much. That's crazy.

[turboguy]

Harold, after I took a look at that site I checked a couple of my other sites mostly because I also thought it was high. What it was actually tracking was the operating systems since the tracking program was installed which was 6 or 7 years ago. Back in those days the percentage of users with XP would have been very high. On one of my newer sites with the same tracking XP is showing about 7%. That too may be a bit high.

Realizing that also lets me know that when I check mobile usage the low numbers I get are probably computed the same way and meaningless.

[Harold Mansfield]

I can believe 7%. Maybe even 10%.

[Brian Altenhofel]

I haven't had Flash installed on any machine in my possession in at least 5 years (basically soon after browsers started implementing support for <video> from the HTML5 draft).

[billbenson]

You know, I'd almost forgotten about all the flap about Flash being useless from years ago from a SEO perspective...

I think youtube has a lot of flash video's on there though.

[turboguy]

Well, I guess I can throw out the book I bought years ago that was about 900 pages on how to use Adobe Flash. The good thing is I never did read it to any extent. I probably have more how too books that I have never read than those I have read.

[Harold Mansfield]

A lot of sites that host their own video still use flash. So you can't dump it completely. Maybe it's done as a browser add on or tool, but I still need it for some things.

[billbenson]

I probably have a Flash book around here as well vintage 2002. Flash probably has value for doing a pretty Power Point presentation if it's just on your pc. Outdated for the web though.

[Brian Altenhofel]

A lot of sites that host their own video still use flash. So you can't dump it completely. Maybe it's done as a browser add on or tool, but I still need it for some things.

It's been 5 years since I *viewed* a video requiring Flash. I've seen the placeholders, but to me it's just wasted space.

[vangogh]

A lot of sites that host their own video still use flash

But there's no reason to anymore. There are better options now. Some Flash video is just old. I know I have some on my site. If it's recent then it's because whoever put it up either doesn't know how to use another format or doesn't want to spend the time converting the video to other formats.

I bought my current laptop in April and it doesn't have Flash installed. I haven't missed anything on the web. A few videos here and there won't play, but nothing I felt I had to see. The few I wanted to see I loaded up my iPad (also without Flash) and they work there. That's a case of a developer who knows how to use other formats, but made the assumption that on a laptop or desktop they would use Flash.

The proper way to do it is to play MPEG4 and WebM and use Flash as a fallback only. Every browser now accepts either of the first two so Flash isn't necessary, except for older browser versions. There are plenty of free tools both online and as native apps that will convert video into different formats.

[Harold Mansfield]

B
The proper way to do it is to play MPEG4 and WebM and use Flash as a fallback only. Every browser now accepts either of the first two so Flash isn't necessary, except for older browser versions. There are plenty of free tools both online and as native apps that will convert video into different formats.

So I can probably get rid of it and the browsers will apply the right tool to play them now if they aren't using an updated format?

[vangogh]

It's not so much the browser as it is the people behind the site. Unfortunately there are sites that still only use Flash and if you like any of those sites and can't live without them, then you're probably running Flash to get their content. The sites no longer need to use Flash, but some do.

I use a script called video.js (http://www.videojs.com/), that makes it easier to work with HTML5 video. There's a WordPress plugin for it too. You add the .js file (or the plugin) and then your video code will look something like this:



<video controls preload="auto" width="640" height="264">
<source src="http://path-to.mp4" type='video/mp4' />
<source src="http://path-to.webm" type='video/webm' />
<source src="http://path-to.ogv" type='video/ogg' />
</video>


There are additional options for controls and to display a default image before the video plays, but the key is the different sources. The .ogv one may not longer be necessary. That was for Firefox and I think last week or the week before they added support for .webm. I guess you'll still need .ogv for older browsers.

The hardest part is waiting for the videos to convert and spending the time making the conversion.

The video tag itself plays the right file. I assume it finds the first one in the list that will play in the current browser and then it plays it. I think you can still add .flv files as fallbacks too.

The latest versions of all major browsers support the HTML5 video element and they can all play something other than Flash. No iOS device is capable of running Flash and if I'm not mistaken most Android devices no longer install it by default.

[Harold Mansfield]

OK.
Well, there is one webcasting site that I do watch on my computer at times, and I notice that when I make their videos full screen flash takes over. Actually a lot of videos on the web that I make full screen go right through flash. Is that me because I still have it installed, or is it them?

I don't have flash on my Android devices and the only videos I ever watch on them are usually You Tube. Maybe Netflix.

[vangogh]

I'm not sure. I've noticed sites will serve Flash when I'm browsing on my laptop that doesn't have Flash, but when I look at the same page on my iPad I get an HTL5 video that plays fine. Clearly that site could deliver non-Flash, but they set up their code in a way that assumes if I'm not on a mobile device that Flash is my only option. When that happens I don't watch the video. If I really want to see it, I'll open the page in my iPad and watch. That rarely happens. I can count the number of times on one hand,

Obviously it depends on the sites you visit. You might enjoy a site that still requires Flash. I haven't found any for myself. Every so often I do come across something I'd like to watch and can't, and then I realize how many other websites there are to entertain and inform me. I really haven't missed not having Flash installed. I also don't miss the near daily pop to upgrade Flash for the latest security threat.

YouTube supports non-Flash, though you'll still find Flash embedded on older pages. My site still has some embedded Flash video. I just checked and Netflix supports non-Flash too. I could play a video. If you run into problems, it'll be with smaller sites who either don't know Flash isn't necessary, or are just doing things the same way they always have. If you can't live without one of those sites then you may decide to keep Flash.

Flash was a great solution to playing video. It was the only workable solution for years. There are better solutions now though.

I do land on pages with non-playing videos and a message saying I need to install the latest version of Flash to watch. I just can't think of any that were so important to me that I cared. You can try running without it for a few weeks and then decide. I've been running without Flash for a few months and I don't plan on installing it again.

[Harold Mansfield]

I could watch the content on the site I'm talking about via Roku, so it's not imperative to keep it just for them. I'll probably dump it and see how things go. I know I need to.

[vangogh]

I was a little nervous at first, but I haven't missed Flash. Like I said, there's an occasional site with a video I can't load, but none that were so important to me that I felt a need to see the video.

[Kumar Palani]

I guess news travels slow in Firefox and Facebook land.

I don't have Flash installed on my any device and I haven't missed it at all. I barely even notice it's not there. Occasionally a video insists on using Flash, but I can't think of any that were so important to me. I just move on to the next thing. I know I don't miss the daily popup telling me to install the latest version of Flash for the newest security threat.

Flash was a good program years ago when it was the only way to reliably play video on the web. That changed years ago and it simply isn't necessary any more and every day less and less people will be able to view them.

Forgive me if I am a bit too dumb, but what else do we have other than installing flash to view videos? To this moment I am updating flash, but would be eager to know of any alternative to flash.

[Brian Altenhofel]

Forgive me if I am a bit too dumb, but what else do we have other than installing flash to view videos? To this moment I am updating flash, but would be eager to know of any alternative to flash.

Flash isn't necessary with most browsers on most modern sites displaying videos. For several years, video has been able to be displayed using HTML5 or Javascript.

[Kumar Palani]

Flash isn't necessary with most browsers on most modern sites displaying videos. For several years, video has been able to be displayed using HTML5 or Javascript.

Thanks for the information.

[vangogh]

Came across this article about hack to Flash (http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/08/03/hackers-exploit-flash-vulnerability-in-yahoo-ads/) and thought I'd add it to the thread.

The gist is there was an attack using Yahoo's ad network. The attackers purchased ads on Yahoo's network and the ad contained malicious Flash code. Anyone visiting a page with the malicious ad downloaded the code. This was a Windows only attack and Yahoo closed it 7 days after it started.

[billbenson]

Interesting because Nigerian scam artists years ago always used Yahoo mail, not hotmail or other free email services. I don't get so many scams these days from Nigeria.

Just a comment. I don't want to hijack the thread.

[vangogh]

Can you hijack a thread you started?

[billbenson]

:) Forgot I started this one,