update....

[greenoak]

business is pretty good....we are up a lot from last year..apparantly we are surviving in this economy...
i f i did a swot test the looming threat...known threat anyway, is that our exit on the highway might be closed ...we are on a major highway and the state is turning it into limited access...which means most of the crossroads in our rural county willl be closed ..no one knows the actual plan yet...they are working about 40 miles up the road now........
it seems like a coming disaster that i cant imagine a fix for.....we dont know when its going to happen.... very murky details but its in the big plan.
.we get business off the highway and have 4 billboards..... if they had to snake around 2 or 3 miles to get to us it wouldnt work at all....
our store is over 8000 sq ft plus a huge amount of outside space too....big parking lot and outdoor display of a huge garden section....
its on our land...
. to reproduce this would cost a fortune....im 65 and not ready to retire.i would gladly go another decade or 2!!!!.....but worse, our son is in the business with us so it would be so awful to close up .....im usually so optimistic and flexible....but i dont see a fix for this....not one that would cost under 4 or 500,000$$$$ anyway...
any wild ideas for me???
ann

[Spider]

Get talking to your local politician, as soon as possible. It's their job to keep their constituency viable, and keeping a large local business like yours alive is part of that viability.

About 200 yards from where I live is an auto repair shop that has been at this location since the main road was a two-lane farm-to-market rural highway. It is now a 7-lane very busy thoroughfare. Then the authorities decided to build an underpass for a cross street. All this construction over the years has chipped away at the property of the autoshop, and the latest roadworks would have meant closing down the business. Like yours, the whole family is in the business.

They took an active approach to the political machine and started lobbying their local political representatives. Eventually got the construction plans modified so that they could remain.

Seems to me, Ann, you need your representatives to pressure the Transport Authority to design one of the exit ramps for the new highway to be appropriate for your business.

It's time to get something back for all the taxes you paid!

[Harold Mansfield]

I agree with Frederick, you have to get on your local politicians. I could see if you were in the middle of a thriving metropolis and it was necessary for logistics, but in a rural area to make such a move that would close a family business? Seems like you can make a case.

I would get everyone on it, start a petition that you could ask your customers to sign, take it to Facebook, Twitter and any of the social media that you use to get support from people in the area or people in general.

Your only hope is to convince the planning commission that it is possible for them to move ahead with progress without killing a family business, or do they want to be known as the politicians who put an entire family our of business for a road ?

[greenoak]

thanks....such good ideas..i wonder if it would work....
.they wiped out 20 businesses up the road in a small city, south bend.........so im not very hopeful...sadly our town isnt the traffic bottleneck problem in any way.....
ann

[Harold Mansfield]

Remember that highway funds come from the Feds. You may be better off skipping the local politicians and going straight to your Congressman, Senator, or the Dept. of Transportation.
If your lively hood is on the line, you need to go full boat. If you just go to the locals, it will never reach who it needs to above them, because they have likely petitioned for the funds from the feds to do the project in the first place.

And if this is stimulus money, maybe you can use that to your advantage..."Stimulus money being used to crush local businesses"...that's a nice headline that I'm sure no one in Washington wants to see..:)

[dynocat]

Along with the politicians (starting at the top is a great idea), be sure to contact a local newspaper or two. They're always looking for stories. Yours would be a great one. You are not only a family owned business, but one that's been contributing to the local economy for XX years.

If you can get some public sentiment behind you, the highway plan can change.

[Spider]

thanks....such good ideas..i wonder if it would work....
.they wiped out 20 businesses up the road in a small city, south bend.........so im not very hopeful...sadly our town isnt the traffic bottleneck problem in any way.....
annAnn, I don't believe city and transport planners go out of their way to close businesses and destroy communities. None of them wake up in the morning and think, "How many small businesses can I ruin today?!"

They think of the benefits their plans can bring. But they are not omnipotent, and can often miss or not appreciate all the ramifications of their desire to do good. Making traffic flow better to benefit one area of town can - quite unnoticably until it is too late - mess things up somewhere else. I venture to suggest that the destruction of 20 businesses in South Bend was an unforseen consequence of some other improvement. And that, in fact, the destruction of those businesses came about because the businesses themselves did nothing to prevent their own demise.

Get off your booty and start lobbying! Don't be like those 20 others who either started too late or didn't start at all.

[Business Attorney]

I agree with Frederick that it is worth a try but I suspect if they are doing the work now, decisions were made and the necessary rights of way were acquired long before now.

I grew up in a small Illinois town. For over a hundred years, the National Road, stretching from Baltimore to East St. Louis, ran right through the middle of town. In fact, when the town was first laid out in the 1830's, it was intentionally located on the route of the National Road.

Somewhere, about 70 to 80 years ago, a bypass was built and the road, by then known as US 40, skirted the edge of the town. Still, it was easy to turn into town at every intersection, or to take Business 40 (the old route) right through the town. Even with that access, though, the downtown was forever changed.

Then, in the 1970's, Interstate 70 was built through our part of the state. The Interstate more or less followed the route of US 40 and passed just a mile north of the old route. There is one exit from the Interstate for the town, and some new businesses (fast food chains, gas stations and two motels) sprung up there, but the new traffic pattern eventually was a death knell for the gas stations, motels and restaurants that existed in town before the arrival of the interstate. Some survived longer than others, but once the travelers were routed away, the end was only a matter of time.

Highway planners have been dealing with the side effects of building limited access highways for more than 50 years. They have heard it all before. But if they add an exit every place where someone wants one (rather than where traffic needs dictate), it would not be a limited access highway.

Fortunately for Ann, though, I suspect that Green Oak is more of a destination spot than the small town motels, gas stations or family restaurants, so the extra mile or two will make less of a difference to her.

[greenoak]

that sounds like our towns highway history david.....
i feel like you do they have their plan...and arent open to much...my dh is on a planning board trying to deal with when and what to do for ambulances etc...and they wont even really talk to them....they havent actually bought right of ways in our county yet....as far as i know anyway...
we figure a big portion of our customers would still come....but the new ones who are always important would just sail on by..
.and that garmin thing we all have in our cars is good too....

[Patrysha]

I know that our town is fighting a highway plan that is not even expected to come into being for 15-20 years...but business owners are mobilizing now to keep it from happening and to help guide the transportation departments plans so they don't bypass our town.

[Business Attorney]

It's also interesting that what the Interstate Highway System in the United States did in the second half of the 20th century to small towns they bypassed, the railroads had done to many other small towns 100 years earlier. If there were two similar nascent villages in a general area and one got the railroad line and the other didn't, the one with the railroad is probably still around today and the other, if any evidence of it exists at all, is a few old houses on a dusty country road (like my Grandmother's birth place of Toto, Indiana - although in fairness it did have a depot on the NY Central Rwy at one time).

[billbenson]

Look what happend to Route 66

[Business Attorney]

At least in Illinois, a lot of small towns on the historic Route 66 look a lot like they did 50 years ago. Interstate 55 (which largely parallels old Route 66) takes you from Chicago to St. Louis in about 5 hours and with most cars you don't even need to stop for gas.

[greenoak]

david...now toto is a discount/junky town just a county or 2 over from us........kind of famose tho, thanks to one family.the baileys....
and .i know a neat 80 yr lady who grew up in toto who probably knew your grandmother....its sure a small world...
dh says the state hasnt bought any rights of way yet in our county......so im taking that as a good sign...i just cant dwell on this a lot , its so iffy..but im talking up these ideas you threw out to me to see if we would want to really start a campaigne.........so again thanks...
ps....did somethng hapen to the spell check.?..i cant seem to use it like before...i never download anything...orders from above....
ann

[billbenson]

If you mean words being highlighted as spell check, that may be a problem / setting in your browser. Writing this post the spell check is working fine.

[greenoak]

when i click on the abc thing after writing a post.......my screen says i have to download somethng to get it....that is different from a few months ago isnt it? and i dont want to download anything ...without asking dh ...
ann

[Harold Mansfield]

I don't think the spell check has anything to do with the forum. I think that is a setting of your browser.

As far as I know there is no spell check in the post editor.

[huggytree]

id start looking for a new location

is this possible?

[Spider]

Browsers have a spellchecker?

How about IE-8? If so, where is it? Can't find it in 'Tools" or in 'Customize'

[greenoak]

up on the right hand side at the top as im posting this right now... there is an abc and a checkmark...for spellchecking...then it wants to send me somewhere else... ..
sounds good huggy....but we have a huge store, over 8000 sq ft... with a truck dock and parking lot etc etc.....it would cost a whole lot....but that sounds good to me...of course we dont know where the highway exits will be so it would be hard to make a smart decision at this point even if we could manage it financially....also im 65....and maybe dont want new debt...
ann

[huggytree]

i only see 2 options:

1. stay put and except the loss of business
2. move

either way your going to lose or spend $...your stuck...

at 65 id sell the business and move to Hawaii....

all the antique malls we used to go to were right off the free way. we had a few that we would go to regularly, but when on other trips we would always stop at new ones we saw from free way signs.....id bet with losing your free way exit you'll lose 1/3+ of your business...you will completely lose your customers brought by your signs....the people who make planned trips will still do it.

if i lost 1/3rd of my business id be out of business....or close to it.

if your planning 20 more years i dont see any reason not to move. if your planning on 5 years id say and except lower profits.

[Spider]

up on the right hand side at the top as im posting this right now... there is an abc and a checkmark...for spellchecking...then it wants to send me somewhere else... Seems as though you are referring to the controls of the Reply window, not the browser you are using, no?



sounds good huggy....but we have a huge store, over 8000 sq ft... with a truck dock and parking lot etc etc.....it would cost a whole lot....but that sounds good to me...of course we dont know where the highway exits will be so it would be hard to make a smart decision at this point even if we could manage it financially....also im 65....and maybe dont want new debt...
annYou may not know where the highway exits are going to be, Ann, but if they are planned already, the knowledge is public information and you can find out where they are going to be. If they have not been planned yet, you have a better chance of getting them changed. "The squeeky wheel gets the oil!" So start getting very squeeky - with your congresman, representative, local council, any and all chambers of commerce in the area, start making a nuisance of yourself at the county courthouse. The information you need is public information and you are entitled to know this.



i only see 2 options:
1. stay put and except the loss of business
2. move
either way your going to lose or spend $...your stuck...
at 65 id sell the business and move to Hawaii....
all the antique malls we used to go to were right off the free way. we had a few that we would go to regularly, but when on other trips we would always stop at new ones we saw from free way signs.....id bet with losing your free way exit you'll lose 1/3+ of your business...you will completely lose your customers brought by your signs....the people who make planned trips will still do it.
if i lost 1/3rd of my business id be out of business....or close to it.
if your planning 20 more years i dont see any reason not to move. if your planning on 5 years id say and except lower profits.Unless the idea of selling the business appeals to you, Ann, I would take a completely different line. Even if you sell, you would still have to do everything you would otherwise do, because you will be selling a business that is facing some serious obstacles, and it would not fetch anything like what it would have brought before this highway development came to light.

Loss of business is not guaranteed unless you choose to make it so. You need to get involved in the planning of the exits. You need to be lobbying for compensation. You need to be planning future advertising and promotion that will counter any difficulties imposed by the development.

There is also another aspect that hasn't been mentioned. The changes to traffic flow will have more than one consequence. Not only will there be negative consequences, there will also be positive consequences. You need to analyze them all, so that you can negate the negative consequences and enhance the positive consequences. This could even be a great boost to your business. Check with your neighbors - are they planning to leave? Could you acquire their businesses and land at distressed prices? How else could you benefit from these circumstances?

It seems you have early warning of what is to come. That gives you a tremendous business advantage. Go make some money, Girl!

[greenoak]

frederick,my dh is on the county planning and highway board and even they cant get info.its not public yet...the goal is public.....we are trying to stay on top of it ....im taking all this in .....
huggy i see everything you are saying and mostly agree... ...but i know this must sound wierd but 65 doesnt feel that old when you are there....i love work.....and would rather work than retire in hawaii...ha ha...my dh doesnt feel that way..luckily hes a lot younger...
all i know is i used to be able to spell check on here and now i cant....
my son thinks we would just lose about a third of our business...and that he could still make it work at that....i kind of doubt it...
business is picking up!!! im feeling good about that...

[Spider]

Aah! If you continue believing you will lose a third of your business, I guarantee you will lose a third of your business. And I would put money on a bet that says your loss of business will be almost exactly one-third.

"What we think about, we bring about!"

If you start believing that you wil not lose any business, and start working on making sure you do not lose any business, you won't.

And, furthermore, if you start convincing yourself that there are benefits to be gained in this situation and that you will gain business from it, and start working on ways you can gain from it, you will gain from it.

I've seen this sort of thing happen too many times to not believe what I'm saying is true.

[greenoak]

thanks frederick...i feel like that too in my head.......i just dont quite see how the good outcome is going to happen...YET...
hopefully i ll be really old when it does and ga-ga....
i really believe in optimism...in a realistic, wheres the beef, kind,of way...
ann

[Spider]

I understand, Ann. I am constantly told by people, "You have to be realistic." What I hear them saying, though, is, "I cannot see how good will come of this, I can only see bad coming of it, therefore the only realistic outcome is bad."

Here is my rationale for my argument against this --

1. If I only see bad as a possible outcome, I will feel down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, afraid. Nobody can logically expect bad things to happen and feel good about it.

2. If I am going to make good things happen out of a bad situation, am I more likely to be successful feeling bad, down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, afraid - or am I more likely to be successful when feeling happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure?

3. If I feel down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, and afraid, won't my attitude and demeanor help bring about the bad things I am expecting?

4. Therefore, the only way to turn a bad situation around is to feel happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure, and do those things a happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure person would do.

5. But, we said in Step 1, Nobody can logically expect bad things to happen and feel good about it. Therefore, to feel good, we must stop expecting bad things to happen.

6. Now, I don't care if it is illogical, impractical, unrealistic or just plain stupid, it's obvious that I have a better chance of finding and creating good out of a bad situation by feeling happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure, and acting in that fashion.

In a nutshell - to Hell with being realistic!


"The reasonable person adapts himself to the conditions that surround him... The unreasonable person adapts surrounding conditions to himself... All progress depends on the unreasonable person." -- George Bernard Shaw

[dynocat]

Ann, I'm testing out your spell check problem.

When I reply any misspelled word is automatically underlined in red. Right clicking on the word brings up options.

If you're using Firefox browser, click on Tools/Options/Advanced. There you'll see a checkbox for "Check my spelling as I type." Maybe it's something that was unchecked at some point?

Hope that helps.

[dynocat]

I understand, Ann. I am constantly told by people, "You have to be realistic." What I hear them saying, though, is, "I cannot see how good will come of this, I can only see bad coming of it, therefore the only realistic outcome is bad."

Here is my rationale for my argument against this --

1. If I only see bad as a possible outcome, I will feel down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, afraid. Nobody can logically expect bad things to happen and feel good about it.

2. If I am going to make good things happen out of a bad situation, am I more likely to be successful feeling bad, down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, afraid - or am I more likely to be successful when feeling happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure?

3. If I feel down, negative, unhappy, discontented, disappointed, and afraid, won't my attitude and demeanor help bring about the bad things I am expecting?

4. Therefore, the only way to turn a bad situation around is to feel happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure, and do those things a happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure person would do.

5. But, we said in Step 1, Nobody can logically expect bad things to happen and feel good about it. Therefore, to feel good, we must stop expecting bad things to happen.

6. Now, I don't care if it is illogical, impractical, unrealistic or just plain stupid, it's obvious that I have a better chance of finding and creating good out of a bad situation by feeling happy, up, positive, contented, confident and secure, and acting in that fashion.

In a nutshell - to Hell with being realistic!


"The reasonable person adapts himself to the conditions that surround him... The unreasonable person adapts surrounding conditions to himself... All progress depends on the unreasonable person." -- George Bernard Shaw

Quoting this because it's worth reading twice. Very well said, Spider.

[greenoak]

at the same time im totally against going into deep debt with money or time on a dumb idea....thats where being realistic and critical helps a whole bunch...i guess you can be happy you avoided a disaser or put your efforts into something better.....
oh the spelling...i just want it to work on here, not me having to go back to my tool bar...thanks dynocat