Angies List...anyone pay to advertise on it here?

[huggytree]

Anglies list keeps calling me...every 3-4 months...they want me to pay to advertise and be at the front of the list

i keep telling them if its so good why lock me in for 6 months? why not let me try it for 2 months at full price?....or give me a deal for the 6 months...

they budge slightly on price, but no where near where its worth it to me...

im wondering if anyone has had any luck advertising here? ive found that all advertising for my type of business only brings out price shoppers and no real business.

ive wasted so much money in the past for almost no results.....i dont want to do it again

[Steve B]

I don't think I'm even listed on Angie's List. I used to hear a lot about it, now I don't know if it's popular anymore. I don't think I'd advertise on it.

On the other hand, I spend a lot on Google Adwords and I'll continue to do so. It is one of the few things that consistently pays for itself.

This year, I'm only going to advertise with places that are willing to do it on a straight commission basis. I'm tired of throwing money away for nothing. If they are confident they can bring me results, then I'll send them $xx for every job it gets me. I totally expect that not a single advertiser will go for this arrangement, but it will be fun telling them my conditions and listening to them back away from all their confidence.

[huggytree]

i have 1 review on Angies list

[Spider]

....i keep telling them if its so good why lock me in for 6 months? why not let me try it for 2 months at full price?....or give me a deal for the 6 months...they budge slightly on price, but no where near where its worth it to me... Ahem! Sounds just little like bargaining to me!

http://www.small-business-forum.net/managing-your-business/4229-seeing-problem-customer-ahead-time-turning-down-work.html

:-)

[huggytree]

bargaining YES!!.....why? because i really dont want their product because i dont think it works

apples to oranges Fredrick, but i get your point!

[jamesray50]

I've never heard of them.

[huggytree]

they will not allow me to pay full price, but for only 2 months....i refuse to sign a 6 month contract...

they call me every 3 months...im going to tell them not to call anymore next time

if the product works there would be no min. signing time......ive only found poor quality advertising products to lock you in for more than 1 try....

[Patrysha]

if the product works there would be no min. signing time......ive only found poor quality advertising products to lock you in for more than 1 try....

As a former radio rep, I have to disagree with that one :-) Even direct mail data shows that repeated contact is necessary to maximize the investment. There are many things that work that need more than one shot.

Not that I'd pay for Angie's List listings, but just disagreeing that requiring a commitment is a sign of poor quality in advertising.

[Steve B]

I'll just pass on my experience - for what it's worth.

I owned a direct mail advertising magazine and, obviously, had to sell advertising. We had a three issue min. when we signed someone up. I've advertised my fence business in my own magazine for 2 years (a total of 24 issues) and for 3 years in a row (36 issues) in a similar magazine in our area. I've done cable TV two different times (for several months in a row, many spots per day etc.). I've sent out numerous direct mail pieces (often repeating to the same list up to 4 times) and I have been handing out my literature in newspaper boxes for many years (often repeating to the same areas). I've done several other print advertising things - all of them required a min. number of issues. Some of these things I've done for 4 different businesses that I've owned. I've also read lots of marketing books and articles that tell you how important it is to repeat your message.

My experience is that in every single one of these examples I experienced the most phone calls the first time I did something (the first issue, or the first few days of the TV advertising). Or, even the first time I go through a neighborhood with my litereature. As the owner of the magazine, I also got lots of feedback from my advertisors. Many of them told me they had the same experience. It worked pretty well the first issue, then it tailed off and the calls dried up.

I am completely convinced that the advertising sales people are wrong about the benefit of repeating (at least within the same product). The requirement is primarily in place so they can lock in an advertisor for a longer period of time. I also beleive they are not being dishonest, because everything they have ever read or been told durng their training tells them that repeating is important.

I'm sure repetition is important and can work for many businesses in many areas. I'm sure it's not an accident that Coke, Ford, Pepsi etc. all keep on advertising month after month and year after year in the same magazines or TV slot. But, for whatever reason, for the local service type businesses that I've owned it hasn't worked for me.

With that said, I have experienced a lot of sales because people have seen my message several times. But, it's typically with several different mediums (I saw you on TV, then I got a flyer in my newspaper box, and my co-worker has told me about your service). So, I do the opposite of popular wisdom. I advertise in something for whatever the min. is and when the effectiveness dries up - I move on to something else. This year, I'm changing my strategy again. I will only advertise in something if they will do it on a commission basis. I'll tell them how many jobs I get as a result, then I will pay them x amount per new customer. I realize it's unlikely that anybody will agree to this - and, that will be O.K. for me this year.

[scadush]

Steve....advertising does work for most businesses every month because of the way people are in the market for most services. Most advertising like direct mail or magazine, TV, Radio, etc is "Push" advertising whereby you send out a message or offer to the same people hoping that a certain percentage will be in the market for what you have that particular month. For instance, when you need a car, you notice all car advertising until you actually buy a car, then you fall out of the market and no longer even notice the ads. This is true for sofas, dentists, you name it. And, as soon as you fall out of the market, another person is entering it because their car gave out where the previous month when you were interested and in the market, they were happy with their car and not yet ready to consider any car advertising. If you could just send one ad message to everyone who is a potential client or customer one time that would be nice. But that is not the buying pattern of consumers.

Pull advertising is the internet and why it is so important in todays marketplace. People search for things on their own terms when they are in themarket. They can check reviews, posts, etc and decide what's best and available without ever leaving their home or place of business. For this reason alone, Online shopping doubles every year and will continue to do so. No matter what you do, why second guess advertising. Every ad or offer should have a trackable phone number that records the call and origin so you know how many leads are generated. Only in this way, can you judge monthly advertising and different media sources effectively.


I'll just pass on my experience - for what it's worth.

I owned a direct mail advertising magazine and, obviously, had to sell advertising. We had a three issue min. when we signed someone up. I've advertised my fence business in my own magazine for 2 years (a total of 24 issues) and for 3 years in a row (36 issues) in a similar magazine in our area. I've done cable TV two different times (for several months in a row, many spots per day etc.). I've sent out numerous direct mail pieces (often repeating to the same list up to 4 times) and I have been handing out my literature in newspaper boxes for many years (often repeating to the same areas). I've done several other print advertising things - all of them required a min. number of issues. Some of these things I've done for 4 different businesses that I've owned. I've also read lots of marketing books and articles that tell you how important it is to repeat your message.

My experience is that in every single one of these examples I experienced the most phone calls the first time I did something (the first issue, or the first few days of the TV advertising). Or, even the first time I go through a neighborhood with my litereature. As the owner of the magazine, I also got lots of feedback from my advertisors. Many of them told me they had the same experience. It worked pretty well the first issue, then it tailed off and the calls dried up.

I am completely convinced that the advertising sales people are wrong about the benefit of repeating (at least within the same product). The requirement is primarily in place so they can lock in an advertisor for a longer period of time. I also beleive they are not being dishonest, because everything they have ever read or been told durng their training tells them that repeating is important.

I'm sure repetition is important and can work for many businesses in many areas. I'm sure it's not an accident that Coke, Ford, Pepsi etc. all keep on advertising month after month and year after year in the same magazines or TV slot. But, for whatever reason, for the local service type businesses that I've owned it hasn't worked for me.

With that said, I have experienced a lot of sales because people have seen my message several times. But, it's typically with several different mediums (I saw you on TV, then I got a flyer in my newspaper box, and my co-worker has told me about your service). So, I do the opposite of popular wisdom. I advertise in something for whatever the min. is and when the effectiveness dries up - I move on to something else. This year, I'm changing my strategy again. I will only advertise in something if they will do it on a commission basis. I'll tell them how many jobs I get as a result, then I will pay them x amount per new customer. I realize it's unlikely that anybody will agree to this - and, that will be O.K. for me this year.

[Steve B]

I appreciate your definitions of Push and Pull advertising. Do you have any experience and specific results you can share with either of these?

[lucas.bowser]

I've never advertised with Angie's List, but I used to be a member when I lived in Indianapolis, and I definitely used it when i was selecting a contractor (as did most of my friends there.) Some areas have a larger network of members than others, so the effectiveness for you will depend on:

1) Number of members in the area you service
2) How those members choose their Contractors

If the members only pay attention to the reviews, and not the advertising, then the advertising will be useless to you. If they place some weight on the ads because they know that only A&B rated companies appear there, then it could be useful.

FWIW... My friend is a handyman in Indianapolis who advertises with Angie's list, and has been one of the more effective advertising vehicles he uses. About 15% of his business is from Angie's List. 5% is from other advertising (thrifty nickel, craigslist, etc...). 40% is repeat customers. 40% is referral business. Indianapolis was one of the first networks for Angie's list due to its proximity to Columbus, and is very well established. I'm not sure about how big Angie's List is around Milwaukee, so it may not be as effective for you. You'd have to weigh that yourself.

[nunya01]

Hi all. This is my first post here. I actually found this site on Google while looking for other people who may have had trouble with Angie's List advertising. I'd like to share my story about Angie's List paid advertising.
I am a small time self-employed electrical contractor in the St. Louis area. I had never heard of Angie's List until apparently one of my customers left a review. Shortly thereafter, AL would call quite often trying to sell me advertising. I resisted for a few years. But, it always seemed like AL customers were "ideal" customers. No "tire kickers" or window shoppers. These were always people who were looking to just have the work done. Granted, none of my AL jobs have ever been "big" jobs. I'd say they average about $200 invoices (not profit).
This area has been devastated by the bad economy, and there are WAY too many electricians. Business was at an all time low, so I decided to bite. I went back and forth with the AL sales agent. It was like pulling teeth to get information. I finally just had him send over the paperwork so I could read over it.
I signed on for about $100 / mo, for 12 months. I had a pretty good stream of AL customers at the time. Usually about 1 per week. Before signing on with AL, I implemented conversion tracking and "where did you find us" phone tracking.
Once the advertising started, I noticed no improvement for the first month. After the first month, my AL leads actually DECREASED! They decreased and stayed in a pitiful state for the entire time. I contacted AL several times to see what the problem was. My account rep changed several times in this period as well. After six months, with no help or insight from AL, I told them to cancel the service. I have about 25 reviews on AL, and all of them are "A". I have no negative or even "B" reviews.
I never paid the cancellation fee, because I felt as if AL sold me a defective product. They absolutely refuse to negotiate or budge on the cancellation fee. They did "lock down" my account so customers cannot see it now.
It's not a very exciting story, but I wanted to share it to possibly save someone else from what I went through.

[huggytree]

if it was $100 a month id do it!!!

they want like $200-300 range(from what i remember)

there are currently 200+ plumbers in my zone....advertising doesnt work AT ALL in almost any form because there are just Soooo many competitors

i used 'Service Magic' for a bit and canceled...they refuses to cancel me because my reason didnt fit their list of acceptable reasons...they even hung up on me once while trying to cancel....i ended up canceling my credit card to stop the charges....


so i know how these scams with canceling can be....once they have their money they are extremely agressive to keep it

i still notice an angies list call once a week or more....i dont answer....now im getting weekly e-mails too....this has been going on for over a year now....i got another positive review 2 months ago....they called daily for a few weeks afterwards

they are VERY agressive

[Steve B]

I just got very rude with my AL person that has been calling me every week for several months. Actually, it has been several people taking turns calling me. Just 2 weeks ago I literally BEGGED her to stop calling me. She called again yesterday! That's when I got rude. I hope I can dish out enough abuse that they are afraid to call me. I was polite at least a dozen times before I hit my limit.

I only have 5 competitors - so I'm going to be seen by anyone that is searching for my service anyway. I think people are smart enough to know that the companies at the top have paid for that spot. That's probably why your response went down once you started advertisinig.

[huggytree]

no getting rid of these guys

i answered the phone and instantly hung up when they said angies list

guess what? he called back 5 seconds later...and i answered again

i now ignore any call from a phone number outside my area code


a while back i had a guy who was calling me 2-3x a day...i finally answered and yelled at him.....why do they think calling me 2-3x a day will make me want their product???

everytime the phone rings i have to stop what im doing, put down my tools and try to get the phone out of my pants before the voice mail picks it up....and then to see the same # calling me from AL is just annoying

[rob0225]

I think this is kind of disingenuous of Angie's List. In their commercial they say no one can pay to be on Angie's List.

[Steve B]

That is what they say. In my opinion it's a lie. But, they technically don't pay to be on Angie's List - they pay to be seen higher on the list. At best it's a gray area.

[huggytree]

its a lie

ill bet 99.9% of its users would consider it a lie

they get money on both ends....its got to be a huge money maker for them......id call it a scam

[Pack-Secure]

It seems to me that you should be able to add your number to the don't call list https://www.donotcall.gov/

[GreaterVisibility]

It seems to me that you should be able to add your number to the don't call list https://www.donotcall.gov/

I may be wrong, but I've always understood that business to business calls are not covered under that.

[watsonww]

I have been paying for this for 5 and a half months now. This only works if you have a great profile already (lots of good reviews). I was told I would be receiving lots of calls because I would be in 1st or 2nd place. While I am high up and have a great deal for Angie's List members I have not received 1 call in the 5 and a half months of advertising because the members skip me to companies with hundreds of reviews. This defeats the purpose of advertising because if you have lots of great reviews you do not need to pay for advertising.
There is a 35% cancellation fee (any company that has this policy knows they're advertising does not work).
So I waisted $1000 for what will probably be 0 customers. Angie's list is out to make as much profit as possible with out any regard for people.

[rob0225]

When I owned my business....everytime someone would come to me to sell me advertising pitching their claims of increased sales and traffic I always asked them to guarantee their claims and if I didn't see them refund me my money. No one bit. :)

[billbenson]

When I owned my business....everytime someone would come to me to sell me advertising pitching their claims of increased sales and traffic I always asked them to guarantee their claims and if I didn't see them refund me my money. No one bit. :)

You need to be careful on that one if you are talking about search engine placement. If someone guarantees traffic it's a big red flag not to use them. Nobody can guarantee you quality traffic to a web site.

[Steve B]

I do the same thing as rob0225. I haven't had a single interested party either. I even promise to pay them a percentage so they can make far more than their flat rate advertising fee. Still, not a single taker.

[BNB]

You need to be careful on that one if you are talking about search engine placement. If someone guarantees traffic it's a big red flag not to use them. Nobody can guarantee you quality traffic to a web site.

Not true. Google has a little thing called AdWords. Yahoo/Bing offer a similar service. :)

[rob0225]

You need to be careful on that one if you are talking about search engine placement. If someone guarantees traffic it's a big red flag not to use them. Nobody can guarantee you quality traffic to a web site.

I had a brick and mortar location. I was referring more to yellow pages/radio/television folks specifically. I even told them their guarantee didn't need to be in increased sales...guarantee the traffic and I would do the rest. No takers.

[kimoonyx]

I think what Steve is saying could have some weight to it, at least in small markets, and I think it has to do with the fact that small markets have saturation points that are easier to arrive at. From time to time I will call up a local radio station and ask if they wanna run a contest with one of my used video game consoles as the prize. The console is my ad fee...and I have found I get a lot of bang for my buck doing it this way as they tend to run many spots and mention the store. The response is always highest when the ads start running and then seem to taper off as the promo keeps rolling. In the first few days... My cellphone lights up with patrons who are excited that they heard us on the radio... And I will get some new walk ins & customers that mention it.... Then inevitably it tapers... Seemingly quickly. Just wanted to echo/share the experience.

[billbenson]

Not true. Google has a little thing called AdWords. Yahoo/Bing offer a similar service. :)

So you are saying black hat techniques of people pitchiing instate and guarenteed placement is where you want to go for your SEO?


You need to be careful on that one if you are talking about search engine placement. If someone guarantees traffic it's a big red flag not to use them. Nobody can guarantee you quality traffic to a web site.

I'll stand by my statement. If someone pitches SEO with guaranteed placement in google SERPS run like hell.

I never mentioned paid advertising such as Adwords

[Harold Mansfield]

Had to come back to this thread. Been getting calls through Angie's List lately. 2 this week. Can't complain. And no I haven't spent any money for additional ads.
Seems to work. Guess it depends on how saturated your field is.

[Zerocool7]

I used Angies list a while back when me and my friend ran a Maint. Business in Atlanta Ga. I know a lot of people use it, I have even used it from time to time to find companies with good reviews. I definatly think it would be beneficial for any business to be on there.

[BNB]

I have been paying for this for 5 and a half months now. This only works if you have a great profile already (lots of good reviews). I was told I would be receiving lots of calls because I would be in 1st or 2nd place. While I am high up and have a great deal for Angie's List members I have not received 1 call in the 5 and a half months of advertising because the members skip me to companies with hundreds of reviews. This defeats the purpose of advertising because if you have lots of great reviews you do not need to pay for advertising.
There is a 35% cancellation fee (any company that has this policy knows they're advertising does not work).
So I waisted $1000 for what will probably be 0 customers. Angie's list is out to make as much profit as possible with out any regard for people.

If you are high up and have received 0 calls, it's not because customers are skipping over you, it's because there are no customers searching. Even with many customers skipping to companies with more reviews, you would still get a call from time to time. I personally would not advertise on Angies List.

[BNB]

I do the same thing as rob0225. I haven't had a single interested party either. I even promise to pay them a percentage so they can make far more than their flat rate advertising fee. Still, not a single taker.

This is a bit short sighted. It's kind of like the saying, "If you can just bring in all the customers and leads, well shucks, I can do the rest" --- bringing in the customers is the hardest part, by far. No advertising company is going to guarantee results. I have spent substantial amounts of money on advertising ventures without guarantees, some have been home runs, others have been duds. Generally, you can test the venture with smaller amounts of capital, then ramp it up if it's working for you.

Who knows, you may have turned down substantial revenue - but then again, you may have saved yourself a lot of money :)

[Harold Mansfield]

This is a bit short sighted. It's kind of like the saying, "If you can just bring in all the customers and leads, well shucks, I can do the rest" --- bringing in the customers is the hardest part, by far. No advertising company is going to guarantee results.

Exactly! There are a hundred reasons why people see your ad and never contact you. If you have good positioning and are getting looks and aren't getting results, I'd turn internally to see what about your presentation isn't attracting people to take the next step, or what are those listed after you doing better.

[IADS]

I thought that you couldn't pay to be on Angie's List... I'm listed there, but not many reviews.

[Steve B]

I thought that you couldn't pay to be on Angie's List... I'm listed there, but not many reviews.

That's the big lie about Angie's List. You can't pay to be "on" Angie's List, but you can pay to be on the top of your category. Angie makes no mention of that in her commercials. I guess she is technically correct, but it seems a bit deceiving to me.

The vast majority of people are too busy with their lives to write reviews. In order to get them, you might want to consider asking your customers to write a review. I had three reviews in 5 years. Then, I sent an e-mail to all my previous customers with a link and a request for them to write a review and I got a dozen more in the next few days.

[BNB]

That's the big lie about Angie's List. You can't pay to be "on" Angie's List, but you can pay to be on the top of your category. Angie makes no mention of that in her commercials. I guess she is technically correct, but it seems a bit deceiving to me.

The vast majority of people are too busy with their lives to write reviews. In order to get them, you might want to consider asking your customers to write a review. I had three reviews in 5 years. Then, I sent an e-mail to all my previous customers with a link and a request for them to write a review and I got a dozen more in the next few days.

I'm still surprised that Angie's List is successful. I couldn't imagine why any consumer would pay to search their service to find a contractor. But it seems to be working anyways, so what do I know.

[Steve B]

I can't imagine how they are successful either. They charge literally a few dollars a year to the consumer, but their expenses must be through the roof. They have enough sales people on staff that they are able to call EVERY SINGLE one of my friends in business at least once a month to bug us to advertise with them. I also see their commercials as much as I see any other commercial on TV. I had to be extremely rude before I finally got them to stop calling me. It took at least 5 attempts of begging them to stop calling!

I also hate the fact that a business gets put on Angie's List whether they want to be there or not. Now I have one more thing to worry about - making sure none of my competitors put in a false review.

[Harold Mansfield]

I also hate the fact that a business gets put on Angie's List whether they want to be there or not. Now I have one more thing to worry about - making sure none of my competitors put in a false review.

That is something that you have to worry about on the web period, not just Angie's List. My advice would be to create the free account for your business, that way you can respond to your reviews instead of just letting bad ones sit there.

Online reputation management is something that you need to be in front of at all times. Anyone, anywhere can register "yourbusiness sucks.com" and there is nothing you can do about it. You should always stay on top of such things.

The suck ass thing about most review sites is that getting bad or fake reviews removed usually takes an act of God or a Federal court, which niether have been helpful with up until now.

That's just one of the pitfalls of the web. It truly is the wild west and it's hard to control something, or apply local laws and ethics to something that everyone on the planet has access to freely to post up whatever they want.

[BNB]

That is something that you have to worry about on the web period, not just Angie's List. My advice would be to create the free account for your business, that way you can respond to your reviews instead of just letting bad ones sit there.

Online reputation management is something that you need to be in front of at all times. Anyone, anywhere can register "yourbusiness sucks.com" and there is nothing you can do about it. You should always stay on top of such things.

The suck ass thing about most review sites is that getting bad or fake reviews removed usually takes an act of God or a Federal court, which niether have been helpful with up until now.

That's just one of the pitfalls of the web. It truly is the wild west and it's hard to control something, or apply local laws and ethics to something that everyone on the planet has access to freely to post up whatever they want.

Most major review sites like Reseller Ratings and Yelp are doing a MUCH better job at filtering fake/false reviews. Thankfully. I think it has to do with pressure from Google as the big G likes to use these ratings in their search results. So these review sites have to be as accurate as possible.

[Business Attorney]

I've used Angie's list many times. Sometimes I've used it to find a contractor. I've used it to find an electrician, a flooring installer and a lab for testing for lead and asbestos. More often, I've used it to vet contractors who have been recommended to me or come to me from other sources such as home shows. I have found that some friends have had a good experience with a contractor who has a number of problematic reviews over the last few years.

I have found Angie's List to be incredibly valuable over the past few years. But I live in a large urban area with dozens to hundreds of contractors in nearly every category. If I ask 10 friends who to use as a roofer, for example, I will likely get 10 different recommendations and have not much more information than when I started. If you were in a smaller community with 3 or 4 roofing companies, you might get much better information from talking to friends, but still probably would not have the cross section of experience you would get from reading five years worth of reviews on Angie's List.

And to respond to the comment by watsonww, I think your observation and objection is valid. As a user of Angie's List, I am looking for positive reviews, so getting near the top of the listing with few or no reviews would not make me buy your services. Angie's List attracts consumers who are looking for feedback on contractors, so it would surprise me if many would bite on a listing just because it was near the top of the list. It sounds to me that in their pitch to sell advertising, the Angie's List ad salespeople are not being realistic about the value proposition in the ads.

[Steve B]

Most major review sites like Reseller Ratings and Yelp are doing a MUCH better job at filtering fake/false reviews. Thankfully. I think it has to do with pressure from Google as the big G likes to use these ratings in their search results. So these review sites have to be as accurate as possible.

Do you have any reason to believe they are doing a much better job? How exactly could they possibly filter fake and false reviews? Are they going to hire a staff to go interview the reviewers and check receipts for work performed? Maybe they could hire a PI to make sure the reviewer doesn't have a personal relationship with the contractor? It's just too easy to fake a review and no reasonable way for them to be verified. I think Harold's "wild west" analogy is much more realistic.

Angie's List had a good concept by being one of the only sites to require a fee to be able to submit a review (although that's not exactly true either). The problem is the fee is so low that it doesn't really screen out the bad actors. In my area, it's actually free to join Angie's List because they don't have enough activity yet. Angie's List has decided to make their big money via advertising revenue. Business Attorney's example of someone not being interested in a business just because they are on top is a good point, but only if they are on top AND have only a few reviews compared to others. Otherwise, it may not be obvious who has paid to be on the top of the list. By the way, Angie's List only allows you to advertise if you have a high rating - so there should never be a case of someone on or near the top of the list with bad reviews. Of course, most businesses have great reviews (since businesses only encourage their happy customers and friends to write reviews).

[BNB]

Do you have any reason to believe they are doing a much better job? How exactly could they possibly filter fake and false reviews? Are they going to hire a staff to go interview the reviewers and check receipts for work performed? Maybe they could hire a PI to make sure the reviewer doesn't have a personal relationship with the contractor? It's just too easy to fake a review and no reasonable way for them to be verified. I think Harold's "wild west" analogy is much more realistic.

Angie's List had a good concept by being one of the only sites to require a fee to be able to submit a review (although that's not exactly true either). The problem is the fee is so low that it doesn't really screen out the bad actors. In my area, it's actually free to join Angie's List because they don't have enough activity yet. Angie's List has decided to make their big money via advertising revenue. Business Attorney's example of someone not being interested in a business just because they are on top is a good point, but only if they are on top AND have only a few reviews compared to others. Otherwise, it may not be obvious who has paid to be on the top of the list. By the way, Angie's List only allows you to advertise if you have a high rating - so there should never be a case of someone on or near the top of the list with bad reviews. Of course, most businesses have great reviews (since businesses only encourage their happy customers and friends to write reviews).

I have very good reason to believe that Reseller Ratings and Yelp do a much better job of filtering reviews for several reasons. For one, Yelp has a VERY good and robust filtering algorithm. Go look up some businesses on Yelp, then scroll to the bottom where it says "Filtered Reviews" - you might be surprised at how many are there, and how many are clearly fake. Generally, Yelp filters out reviews from people who are not active on the site, among other proprietary filters.

As for Reseller Ratings, I'm yet to see a fake review get through. To leave a review, you must include your order date and invoice/order number. They absolutely check these with reviewers from time to time, and if I have a review that is fake, I can easily review their purchase information and see if it's a real customer or not.

This doesn't mean all review sites are as diligent in protecting their integrity, but I think you would be quite surprised at just how accurate these sites are. I mentioned that I believe one reason they are so diligent is that Google uses their ratings on the search results and AdWords. Google only uses a few different sites for this data. The sites they use are diligent about accuracy. Google+ reviews are getting more and more accurate as well.

[Steve B]

Until they develop an algorithm that can determine who is a friend of who - then I'll not be putting a lot of weight on the on-line review sites. As a business, I'm forced to understand and try to have my business present on these sites, but as a consumer I place an appropriate amount of weight on them (almost zero).

I don't know anything about the Reseller Ratings you are referring to - so maybe they are different since it sounds like they have an electronic trail to verify against.

[Harold Mansfield]

You spend enough time online and you start to be able to spot fake reviews just like you can spot fake blog comments. I've seen some really scathing reviews online, but in context with the other 100 reviews of the product or company that are good to excellent, they just didn't make any sense and now I start questioning the motives of the person who put it up...and it likely carries no weight with me.

With that said, and here is one of my favorite Amazon product reviews. Some of these people have some real comedy talent:
Amazon.com: Hutzler 571 Banana Slicer: Kitchen & Dining (http://www.amazon.com/Hutzler-5717-571-Banana-Slicer/dp/B0047E0EII)

[huggytree]

Angie's List only allows you to advertise if you have a high rating - so there should never be a case of someone on or near the top of the list with bad reviews. Of course, most businesses have great reviews (since businesses only encourage their happy customers and friends to write reviews).

false!

i had 3 reviews....2 -A's and 1 F! and they called me constantly before i stopped answering their calls.....

i had a 66% positive rating and they hounded me!

i discussed a few times with their salesman who would pick me with 1 bad review out of 3...they never had a good comeback for that one

luckily ive picked up a few more A's since then to make my reviews look a bit better.....1 bad customer and it will kill you on Angies list....once that review is given there's no way to remove it...no matter how unjustified it is...in my case they didnt even give a reason why i was bad....no way to defend yourself when they just give a bad rating with no other feedback

[CiteAds.com]

What do people think about Craigslist advertising? What keeps so many businesses from using the Classifieds model? How can classifieds improve for small businesses?

[huggytree]

What do people think about Craigslist advertising? What keeps so many businesses from using the Classifieds model? How can classifieds improve for small businesses?

if you are 1/2 the price of your competitors you will do well on craigs list....if you want a fair price for your business you will do poorly

craigs list is where the cheapest 10% of our society goes to shop....you will not find any good customers there

ive tried advertising there in the past with poor results....i advertised a 'plumbing special' on basement bathrooms......i think it was $2,700 including fixtures....and i got calls asking me if the $2,700 included drywall,carpentry,electrical,tile,etc??......if your in construction you'd know that the parts alone would be over $5,000 for that, so its just silly to think my plumbing bid would be the whole room.....actual cost of doing a full basement bath is $12,000+......so for multiple people to truely beileve it could be $2,700 just shows the level of customer.....someone who want something for nothing

do i buy things on craigs list...yes.....do i sell things..yes

when i sell them i know it has to be for dirt cheap.....and i typically sell the things same day......

[CiteAds.com]

Good point. Over saturated marketplace. No filter to entry. Easy to contact owners.

So, classifieds are great for very small services, but the model is broken for larger businesses. Classifieds seem to be the best way for any business to market, innovation is needed to fix the issues.

So what ideas can make Craigslist better for a business?

[huggytree]

So what ideas can make Craigslist better for a business?

nothing

craigs list = cheap spot to buy things

its doing what its meant to do

[Harold Mansfield]

....1 bad customer and it will kill you on Angies list....once that review is given there's no way to remove it...no matter how unjustified it is...in my case they didnt even give a reason why i was bad....

Maybe you blew them off and didn't call back :)

[CiteAds.com]

Alright, if Angie's List had a community classifieds system where all their business users could post about their current coupon or sale, do you think usage would increase?

[Harold Mansfield]

Alright, if Angie's List had a community classifieds system where all their business users could post about their current coupon or sale, do you think usage would increase?
Nope. Not at all.

[huggytree]

Maybe you blew them off and didn't call back :)

ha....nope....it was through a prime contractor......i only met the homeowners for 5 minutes....job went perfect, prime contractor is still someone i work for...they never got any bad review of me.....the homeowner decided to wait 1 year after the job and then give me a bad review.

they are foreign and seemed confused....not very good with the language....i think they confused me with someone else......

once a neg review is there there's no way to get rid of it....even if it may not even be YOU they are reviewing.....

[Harold Mansfield]

You can respond to a review, but be careful not to get into a back and forth. That would be worse.
They answer "how to" here:
how do I remove my review? (General Questions) (http://answers.angieslist.com/how-do-I-remove-my-review-q33879.aspx)

Mistaken identity is definitely possible. I have a good review from someone who I never serviced. Judging by the review I think they have me confused with their local ISP.
I reported it as not me, but it's still up.

[huggytree]

yes i responded

my response was something like 'its hard to respond when the customer doesnt explain what the issue was. the job turned out beautiful and i still work with the builder. at no time did the homeowner ever expess an issue during the project. i only was in the room with the homeowner for 5 mins or less during the whole project. I think there is some kind of confusion here'

they never responded

i tried to get angies list to work as a go between to get it erased.....nothing ever came from it...i believe they e-mailed them and got no response back

the only thing i ever thought of was i mentioned to them to avoid certain faucets because the wife had severe artheritis.....i was doing my job and pointing out things that WILL be important to them.....to make sure she got a faucet that she would be able to work...her hands were all squished up in a ball.....i think this could have offended her and they took it the wrong way since they were from a foreign country.........i see things like that as my job..noticing details that customers dont think about....

in the end im stuck with a bad review forever

ive had the same issue with the BBB....except after 2 years it gets erased

you deal with 1,000 people a year your going to run into some customers who are never happy with anyone and are predators

i get at least 1 nightmare customer a year......i typically give in at least partially to avoid bad reviews somewhere......i think this type of customers knows this ahead of time and does it to everyone as a way of life.....we all know the type......the one that gave me the bad BBB rating had very old galvanized pipes...i replaced a section and a few days later her faucet plugged up with rust (from inside the pipes)....i explained to her it is a pre-existing condition and i did not put rust inside her pipes .i offered to come and clean it out for her w/o any minimum's or trip charges(it would have been $25-35).....she not only wanted me to do it for free, she wanted me to repipe her whole house for free....saying i caused the rust inside her pipes(60 year old house)....also said 'her neighbor said i over charged her'.....and i shouldnt have charged her to carry my tools into and out of her house.......with a customer like this how can you find middle ground????

i tried to get the BBB to throw it out.....i figured it was obvious that this was not a normal expectation from a customer...to expect a $2,500 repipe job from a $250 minor job.....they refused to throw it out....

anyone can complain about you.....i suspect they dont even have to be a customer...just someone who claims they are a customer....the BBB and Angies list doesnt care or have a plan for how to handle unfair complaints

[Steve B]

That sucks about the BBB review HT. And, with the BBB you are PAYING them to be listed with them!

[huggytree]

That sucks about the BBB review HT. And, with the BBB you are PAYING them to be listed with them!

what really sucked is that it happened the exact week i sent a check to the BBB to join......its been a few years now and its gone off my record

being a BBB member means something to some customers, so i pay them their $400 a year so i can put BBB on my cards....i actually got 1 job once from the BBB website