Pricing Take two

[ddesigns]

Part of this is a rant and other other part is my frustrations at the current attitude in the industry.

When I started out over 10 years ago, I didn't know much, so I would take work on for very cheap often getting worked to the bone so I could get the experience.
Alot of the work I did was for designer firms around the area so whatever I did was work for hire and it was always balls to the walls, get **** done as quick as possible.

Most of the time I would get a call and it would go like this "hey, have a little logo project for you, its for xx, and we are hoping to see 3-4 concepts, in a couple days, not a lot of budget, so put int a couple hours." "THere's a lot of work out there, not high budgets but alot of work." So in other words if you are willing to work for much less you can do more work. (of course this was one firms way to get me to lower my rates etc.

This has pretty much been how I have done things most of my design life. The more I did projects like this, the more I thought to myself that it doesn't have to be like this.

I realize that subcontracting for other design firms is a different proposition because they have to make money off of you. I picked up a book on Graphic design pricing and it is kind of an eye opener.

Every time I have bid a project i've kinda always had the mentality of how many hours it will take to do it.

I know certain things, production based tasks there is a benefit of hourly.


From a business perspective, I just think it makes more sense to charge your rates and not sit there and discuss how many hours it will take. That is the production side that you work out.

I mean if I am showing 3 concepts for 1500, I am not worried about hours as much as trying to do the best job for my own integrity. I might nail something in 10hrs, or 20 or 30. But to sit there and then have to come up with concepts when you have a 4hr budget.. it's just impractical.

[Wozcreative]

I work the same way in that, I do flat rates, however I include 2 sets of revisions so that it does not go over budget. It allows me to take more time on it if need be, and most of my clients appreciate having the flat-rate to help them budget better for things. It also allows me to know how much of a deposit to take at the start of the projects. I see no harm in that as long as you are meeting your financial expectations.

[huggytree]

i try to charge a flat rate for projects....that way if your done early its profit in your pocket...there's an incentive to work harder/better

giving your customer a T&M means there's no incentive to improve or be more efficient...i make most of my money on getting jobs done early!

i only do T&M on small/odd projects...typically 1-2 hour projects where the customer cant describe whats going on or a solution cant be figured out over the phone....basically jobs that i dont know what im getting into until im there...this way i cant lose....i may only make $20-30 in profit, but i get a new customer and i also know i cant lose.

it sounds like your problem is you have cheap customers....and its your fault!

YOU choose your customer base....they dont choose you....when you only have cheap customers its a hole you will never dig out of...i dont know how many guys ive known who told me they are starting out cheap and will raise their prices once established....its not a well thought out idea....if they are only choosing you because they are cheap then once you raise your price they are gone....and you have no customers once again....by starting out mid to high priced, but giving the customer a superior product your insuring a long lasting business.....yea its harder to build that way...but once built its rock solid

cheap customers always expect the most...they are horrible customers.....and they will leave you once they find someone $1 less

i suggest you start over, change your pricing structure and be more successful